Whew and thanks. It’s possible if not probable that I mistake “depression” and or ”anxiety” for massive grief for the natural world. Love the cartoon. ❤️❤️ I got your 10,000 things book and really resonated with how gurus etc and holy folks ask questions but their answers are not my answers…..Makes so much sense. My ex husband borrows the book. He is by nature cynical and it appeals to him. Thank you again.
Thanks for writing this Robert - my experience gels with your description: “Every person I know whom I consider “awake” suffers this kind of pain constantly—sometimes in the foreground, sometimes in the background. It casts a pall.”
A pall indeed. I find it incredibly hard to be “awake” in this regard but surrounded by people who are “asleep”. Apart from my partner and some friends online, most everyone I encounter seems to be in the latter category. I say “seems” because perhaps they have an inkling but they just don’t publicly acknowledge it. There’s certainly a lot of what I call “toxic positivity” evident. Especially in “spiritual” people…they’re almost the worst.
Not "almost"! Yikes. Yes I don't know many 'awake' folks. There is quite a loneliness in that....in me. Robert - have you considered a group or...way, say, that people like me who live in Vancouver could meet?
After The Ten Thousand Things was published in 2017, I did many open Zoom meetings. We had a ten-day live gathering here in Todos Santos in 2019 and a ten-day series of meetings online in 2021. Since then, I have participated in various interviews, including with people who consider themselves teachers. Most of that is available on my YouTube channel. Recently, I have been less active that way. If you put together a group and want me to drop in on it virtually, I will. Does that work?
Hi Robert and thanks. Nope - that's not what I was thinking of. And not a 'dating' service. but a way for the folks who are into your Substack to be able to contact one another. I think that is what I'd like. Or maybe there is already a way but I do not think there is.
Agree 1000 percent with your message. It never gets easy.
Mr. Gurdjieff used to call this Conscious Suffering. Krishnamurti experienced what he called "The Process", which if you read "Krishnamurti's Notebook" would be akin to a daily Crucifixion.
In the Gurdjieff Work we trained actively in recognizing Second Force which is Resistance. If we cannot meet our resistance then there can be no spiritual progress. If we do recognize and work with Resistance or suffering consciously then there is a possibility of change.
If I sit to meditate then, and am not comfortable, get up to adjust the light and never get down to business this is an example of Resistance. If recognized Resistance can provide energy and focus to practice. It's not pleasant, but that's kind of the point. Often resistance is unprocessed impressions, repressed psychic pain, which if looked at will dissipate.
All that is to say, it's never easy. No one wants to hear these words. If they hear them, then they think Oh well, that can't be right. But it's the Truth, so there it is. It never gets easy.
Thank you so much for this powerful piece of writing. We hold so many delusions about spirituality and awakening. One is to equate awakening with bliss and happiness without allowing for any transcendence. In that way we can settle for trance because we are not concerned with the nature of reality, only with our own feelings. I won’t go on, you say it much better.
Hey...Nice piece. I think there's certainly a dissonance between even the most "well-intentioned" individual and the stage of our collective cerebral evolution. And, of course, governments, societies and corporations are made up of individuals. I think you're right - we might think we want these long-term effects, but we only exist now.
You are totally right. And one more thing - how many of the “awakened” ones, whatever it means, realize also that the “beautiful world of oceans and flowers” comprises also other sentient, non human animals, in the murder and tormenting of whom they themselves, “awakened”, actively participate (knowingly or not)? Does this augment their “sadness and deep melancholy” while they chew on their bodies (“meat”), their bodies’ products (“dairy”) or whatever coming from the dead or still alive corpses of creatures with whom they share this planet and whom they themselves have been killing daily (directly or indirectly)? Or are they joyously or tragically eating their way to extinction, together with other, “non awakened” part of human animals while experiencing “sadness and the tragic sense of life”? If so then it really does cast a pall. Talk is cheap indeed… :-)
Whew and thanks. It’s possible if not probable that I mistake “depression” and or ”anxiety” for massive grief for the natural world. Love the cartoon. ❤️❤️ I got your 10,000 things book and really resonated with how gurus etc and holy folks ask questions but their answers are not my answers…..Makes so much sense. My ex husband borrows the book. He is by nature cynical and it appeals to him. Thank you again.
A deep , pervasive sense of sadness that so often envelopes this human, who is ashamed to be called human.
Thanks for writing this Robert - my experience gels with your description: “Every person I know whom I consider “awake” suffers this kind of pain constantly—sometimes in the foreground, sometimes in the background. It casts a pall.”
A pall indeed. I find it incredibly hard to be “awake” in this regard but surrounded by people who are “asleep”. Apart from my partner and some friends online, most everyone I encounter seems to be in the latter category. I say “seems” because perhaps they have an inkling but they just don’t publicly acknowledge it. There’s certainly a lot of what I call “toxic positivity” evident. Especially in “spiritual” people…they’re almost the worst.
Not "almost"! Yikes. Yes I don't know many 'awake' folks. There is quite a loneliness in that....in me. Robert - have you considered a group or...way, say, that people like me who live in Vancouver could meet?
Hi, Sharon.
After The Ten Thousand Things was published in 2017, I did many open Zoom meetings. We had a ten-day live gathering here in Todos Santos in 2019 and a ten-day series of meetings online in 2021. Since then, I have participated in various interviews, including with people who consider themselves teachers. Most of that is available on my YouTube channel. Recently, I have been less active that way. If you put together a group and want me to drop in on it virtually, I will. Does that work?
Hi Robert and thanks. Nope - that's not what I was thinking of. And not a 'dating' service. but a way for the folks who are into your Substack to be able to contact one another. I think that is what I'd like. Or maybe there is already a way but I do not think there is.
Also yeah being in Costco today - conspicuous consumption/plastic shit everywhere etc. Yikes!! Time to move to the boonies. And get some donkeys. xoxo
Agree 1000 percent with your message. It never gets easy.
Mr. Gurdjieff used to call this Conscious Suffering. Krishnamurti experienced what he called "The Process", which if you read "Krishnamurti's Notebook" would be akin to a daily Crucifixion.
In the Gurdjieff Work we trained actively in recognizing Second Force which is Resistance. If we cannot meet our resistance then there can be no spiritual progress. If we do recognize and work with Resistance or suffering consciously then there is a possibility of change.
If I sit to meditate then, and am not comfortable, get up to adjust the light and never get down to business this is an example of Resistance. If recognized Resistance can provide energy and focus to practice. It's not pleasant, but that's kind of the point. Often resistance is unprocessed impressions, repressed psychic pain, which if looked at will dissipate.
All that is to say, it's never easy. No one wants to hear these words. If they hear them, then they think Oh well, that can't be right. But it's the Truth, so there it is. It never gets easy.
Thank you so much for this powerful piece of writing. We hold so many delusions about spirituality and awakening. One is to equate awakening with bliss and happiness without allowing for any transcendence. In that way we can settle for trance because we are not concerned with the nature of reality, only with our own feelings. I won’t go on, you say it much better.
I like the way you said this:
In that way we can settle for trance because we are not concerned with the nature of reality, only with our own feelings.
Robert, I so agree with what you've said here. It is a sad business to look at.
Thanks 🙏
Hey...Nice piece. I think there's certainly a dissonance between even the most "well-intentioned" individual and the stage of our collective cerebral evolution. And, of course, governments, societies and corporations are made up of individuals. I think you're right - we might think we want these long-term effects, but we only exist now.
Thank you for this wonderful post. It really hits home.
You are totally right. And one more thing - how many of the “awakened” ones, whatever it means, realize also that the “beautiful world of oceans and flowers” comprises also other sentient, non human animals, in the murder and tormenting of whom they themselves, “awakened”, actively participate (knowingly or not)? Does this augment their “sadness and deep melancholy” while they chew on their bodies (“meat”), their bodies’ products (“dairy”) or whatever coming from the dead or still alive corpses of creatures with whom they share this planet and whom they themselves have been killing daily (directly or indirectly)? Or are they joyously or tragically eating their way to extinction, together with other, “non awakened” part of human animals while experiencing “sadness and the tragic sense of life”? If so then it really does cast a pall. Talk is cheap indeed… :-)